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Violanthe · Webmaster Joined: 24 Jul 2003 Posts: 5903

Is there anything you've read in a book, a badly worded line, poorly executed technique, etc. that you swore you'd never do in your own writing?
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Nik · Senior Member Joined: 07 Dec 2006 Posts: 805 Location: UK

Um, I've shunned graphic sex, drugs etc, unless written very, very carefully and absolutely necessary to the plot.

I'm writing for *me* before I'm writing for anyone else, and if I would not tolerate it...

Sorry, I'm a bit of a prude in such ways...

Violanthe · Webmaster Joined: 24 Jul 2003 Posts: 5903

Well, doesn't that count as gratuitous? If it's unnecessary to the story?
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Nik · Senior Member Joined: 07 Dec 2006 Posts: 805 Location: UK

I must wonder if some authors use an 'If Tuesday, then insert gratuitous sex /drugs /violence' formula to spice up their airport-novels.

A sort of corollary to caution that, in general, each formula halves the sales of a coffee-table book...

Violanthe · Webmaster Joined: 24 Jul 2003 Posts: 5903

Can you give any examples of novels you've read where that graphic violence or sex is truly gratuitous? Where it is truely unnecessary to the plot?

I ask because these "airport novels" I'm guessing are fairly unlikely to be SFF.
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Richard H. Fay · Posted: Fri Oct 24, 2008 9:13 pm

I cannot remember the title, but I recall reading a sword-and-sorcery book several years ago that seemed to have rather gratuitous sex. It was based in an alternative universe, or the imaginary world of a mad mind, where a man from our world became a hero. If I recall correctly, one of his first run-ins with the residents of that alternative universe was a sexual encounter with an evil sorceress that looked exactly like a young Elizabeth Taylor.

Even if that encounter didn't occur in the first few pages like I think it did, it did happen somewhere in the book. And I do believe there were other examples of sex scenes that seem to have been thrown in willy-nilly. Too bad the story itself, the story beyond the sex, didn't make much of an impression. Quite frankly, I was less-than-impressed with the novel.
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Violanthe · Webmaster Joined: 24 Jul 2003 Posts: 5903

What precisely made you think that the scene was gratuitous?
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DougGogerty · Posted: Wed Nov 05, 2008 3:34 pm

I hate to ruin this track of gratuitous sex and violence, but ...

I think even bad writing has its place. I think there is an attitude that believes because writing is an expression of someone's feelings and therefore "art" and thus must be "good" is a bit detrimental.

I think many people are put off by this grandiose art business. The think "why try" if it isn't going to be any good. I just finished reading "So Long and Thanks for All the Fish" by Douglas Adams. From a writer's stand point, it is awful. It is definitely not "fine art." However, Douglas Adams's books have a flavor that reflect the author. If he were to follow the "rules", his writing would suffer.

Taking risks and experimenting will make a good story teller better. Thus, writing a story that breaks some of the rules can be a very good way to find your "voice." So, I'll forgive badly worded lines and poorly executed techniques. It is much better than writing the same story with different settings, etc without ever branchign out.
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Nik · Senior Member Joined: 07 Dec 2006 Posts: 805 Location: UK

Um, I must draw a distinction between the oft-ghastly scribblings of wannabe authors that are yet 'labours of love', crafted to the very limit of their still-modest skill & experience --Been there, done that, kept some--- and dire output from established ('published') authors who really should know better.

I'll exclude 'formulaic' novels which may offer scant scope for variation...

But, as an object-lesson of 'dire', may I offer a recent guest-author's excerpt ??
{FX: Shudder... }
I let it go because I'm not an established author, I lack the academic rigour to do an adequate lit-crit and he was, after all, our guest...